03-08 The Hidden Parks (May 19-21, 2008 in NYC) (3:01:18 / 166 MB)
Day 3 (Spring 2008) – Track 8 – 9:34 AM (9:34:13)

The Overnightscape Underground (onsug.com) – “An audio world to discover and explore.”
Created by Frank Edward Nora (frank@theovernightscape.com) in New Jersey, USA
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Join Frank on his walks to and from work in Midtown Manhattan as he rambles on a wide variety of topics – including mind control and a visit to a cool obscure park by the river.
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License for this track: Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-No Derivative Works 3.0 United States (http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/3.0/us/). Attribution: Include this entire text description.

6 Responses to “03-08 The Hidden Parks (May 19-21, 2008 in NYC)”
  1. Duncan says:

    We’ve been here before Frank, and I hate to say it, but you just lost me.
    I’m not in any way prepared to carry on listening to someone who continually spouts his inane, and utterly unfounded views about “spirituality”, and then in the same sentence thinks he can dismiss atheism or non-belief by describing it as “insane” and “a rebellion against religion”.
    You haven’t got a clue what you’re talking about.

    Two statements first off:

    “A lot of people are turned off by religion, but to go to the extreme of Atheism is insane”

    and

    “If you look at Christianity, which is the religion that most people are rebelling against”

    Atheism isn’t a rebellion against any religion, to say that infers that it’s a belief system in itself, which it IS NOT. To describe it as “insane” is another matter entirely, especially when you’ve just finished saying you believe in “higher beings”.
    I presume you’ve seen these higher beings then? Or are they just in your imagination? I think so…
    There’s nothing at all insane about stating that you will not believe in anything that cannot be proved, or anything that fails to provide substantial physical evidence to support itself. Because that’s what Atheism is, a refusal to believe in unfounded ideas.
    I don’t believe in higher beings, or Gods, or a spirit, because I personally think such beliefs are for weak minded cretins who cling onto some fairytale about the world. A fairytale which isn’t relevant in a time of intellectual enlightenment, scientific research and discovery.
    My truest opinion is that people like you, believers of any spiritual ideology, are holding back human progress with your morbid stupidity.

    You said, and I quote:

    “We don’t know how we got here, Darwinian evolution is COMPLETELY UNPROVEN”

    Wow. How wrong can a guy be, and how utterly deluded. You’re more than willing to believe in utter nonsense like flat earth theory, higher beings that you’ve never seen, heard, smelled or touched, but you’ll dismiss a ‘theory’ which shows more eveidence for it’s truth than anything you believe. Darwinian ‘theory’, HAS been proven. It’s called a ‘theory’ because in strict scientific terms, it’s provable BEYOND ANY REASONABLE DOUBT. That’s all I have to say on that, apart from mentioning that this statement of yours was the straw that broke the camel’s back.
    I’m trying to be restrained here, but quite frankly I think you’re an imbecile.

    What amazes me is that for a man who is so interested in conspiracy theories, you seem utterly uninterested in facts. You dismiss science and non-theism without providing any counter argument, and you swing from this to your utterly immature and ridiculous ideas about the world, and in one fell swoop, spew forth the most insulting and derogatory statements about people whose non-belief you have no concept of.

    And for this, after years of listening, I am turning off.

    Goodnight.

  2. Frank says:

    Duncan,

    I am sorry to hear you have decided to stop listening to the show because of my philosophical musings.

    As I believe I stated later in this recording, vigorous intellectual engagement on this and other issues is something that I believe is a good thing (what I referred to as the “original intent of the Hegelian dialectic”).

    But I see you are so upset emotionally by my ideas that instead of engaging, you are “turning off”. Fair enough, we are all human after all and have to deal with a complex haze of intellect, instinct, and emotion.

    To answer a few of your points…

    Yes, I do have a “sixth sense” – what some call a “psychic” or “spiritual” sense. So I am perceiving “higher beings”, “higher planes”, etc. directly, though admittedly a bit vaguely. So a lot of my basis for my belief in a “spiritual realm” is based on my own direct perceptions. My understanding is that different people have this sense at different levels. Some are completely “blind” (as I assume you are), and some are super-aware. I would say I am in the middle.

    Certainly, it is this “sixth sense” that is part of the basis for my personal philosophy. If indeed you fully lack this sense, I would imagine you would view my assertion of having the sense as a delusion, that “it’s all in my imagination”. Were I in your shoes, I would probably feel the same way.

    And I do also assert that Darwinian evolution in the “macro” sense (origin of life and major changes) is unproven. Micro-evolution, or small variations, is an observable phenomenon.

    Here is an interesting scientific article addressing the lack of evidence in the “origins” department, “The RNA World: A Critique”:

    http://www.arn.org/docs/odesign/od171/rnaworld171.htm

    Ultimately, as I stated on the recording, I am letting people know what my views are on these issues. I know I am not changing anyone’s mind, and that is fine with me. It is not my goal to convert people. But I do think it is worthwhile to express my philosophical musings. I am certainly interested in hearing other people’s beliefs. I even watch “atheist videos” like “The Four Horsemen” – much of which I disagree with – without flipping my lid and losing my cool. I find it interesting, and I enjoy pondering the areas of both commonality and difference – it helps me understand the world around me in a fuller way.

    Frank

  3. Neal says:

    Dunan, I applaud your resilience, having got through “years of listening”, and therefore no doubt become familiar with some of the views that Frank has espouted recently, you managed to forced yourself to go into the “Underground” (where you of course know that anything goes) and listen to a three hour track, fighting off the urge to read the description “he rambles on a wide variety of topics – including mind control” first.

    Well done.

    I’m just curious. Now that you apparently won’t be listening to the Overnightscape, where are you going to find things to become enraged at? Join a Fight Club?

  4. Bill from the Shadows says:

    I for one am enjoying listening to Frank’s decent into madness. Can’t say I agree with his views other than the earth is obviously flat, otherwise I would fall off, and since I’ve soared high in the sky I know that the air is kept in by a lid.

  5. dirtydingo says:

    too funny!
    i disagree with many ideas and theories that float around FEN’s head and surface on ONS and ONSUG and have not once found myself so enraged that i have to quit listening altogether. i find that a sense of insecurity in your own beliefs may be the reason for this enraged move, however, i’m no psychologist. just seems awkward to me at best. anyways, i love what your doing FEN and please keep it up!
    DirtyDingo has spoken.

  6. Ruben S says:

    I hadn’t seen this post before and have only just listened to the audio.

    For what it’s worth I’d like to say that I have no problem admitting I’m an atheist, and to say that that atheism is an extreme like religion is to say that chemistry is an extreme like alchemy, or that astronomy is an extreme like astrology, and I strongly suspect that history will view the former in the same light as the latter two in due course. I’m also of the opinion that religions in general are doing nothing but getting in the way of real progress when it comes to understanding spirituality because religions have a monopoly on spiritual discourse, and it’s a shame.

    Despite this, I still respect Frank’s opinions, I envy his own spiritual progress, and I value the opportunity to see how he views the world, even if we don’t necessarily agree. If people of opposing viewpoints merely cover their ears and walk away we make no progress at all.

    Plus when we get down to it, The Overnightscape Underground is SUPPOSED to be in your face and more “raw” than the polished and produced Overnightscape programme. If I had the guts I would start an underground version of my own show and spend an hour shouting how teaching religion to children is child abuse, or people who don’t believe in evolution but who take medication are hypocrites, and I’m sure Frank would be just fine with it because it’s what is expected of the show! Genre and context are important.

    I’ll still be listening Frank :-)
    Ruben

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